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vrf AW: 7.0 Reminder!

Question asked by VRFuser on Mar 26, 2004
Latest reply on Mar 26, 2004 by VRFuser

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"><HTML><HEAD><META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1"><META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1106" name=GENERATOR><STYLE></STYLE></HEAD><BODY bgColor=#ffffff><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi Detlef, hi Mike,</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><STRONG><FONT color=#ff0000>great idea</FONT></STRONG>. I checked it with my "antique" win98-system and VEE 3 (still very few "vees" left), 5, 6 and will continue this, as soon as VEE7 arrives. </FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>It also helps to keep track of what version I sold without opening the code.... marvellous!</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Peter</FONT></DIV><DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><A href="http://www.pcmess.com">www.pcmess.com</A><BR>Birkenweg 8<BR>D-87677 Stoettwang<BR>Tel: +498345482</FONT></DIV></DIV>---<BR>You are currently subscribed to vrf as: rsb@soco.agilent.com<BR>To subscribe send a blank email to "join-vrf@it.lists.it.agilent.com".<BR>To unsubscribe send a blank email to "leave-vrf@it.lists.it.agilent.com".<BR>To send messages to this mailing list, email "vrf@agilent.com". <BR>If you need help with the mailing list send a message to "owner-vrf@it.lists.it.agilent.com".</BODY></HTML>

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VRFuser Mar 24, 2004 9:45 PM
Mark Correct
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Detlef, that's a very good suggestion. I've seen other programs use numbers in
their file extensions to keep track of different versions, why not VEE? Using
something like .VEE5, .VEE6, .VEE7 (or simply .V5, .V6, .V7) would allow all
VEE versions to co-exist without competing with each other. You just need to
tell Windows Explorer one time which EXE file to use for which extension and
you're set.

Of course, you would have to switch to *.* view to browse for files, as they
would not show up with the *.VEE mask.

Another thing you would have to remember is when you use SAVE AS, that you put
the filename in quotes, like "MyFile.VEE7", then it will save it exactly as
you typed it. If you leave off the quotes, then VEE will tack a ".VEE" to the
end, saving it as MyFile.VEE7.VEE. Pretty simple thing to remember.

Importing libraries with a .VEE6, or .VEE5 extension works as expected. Anyone
see any other reason why this would not be a desirable thing to do for those
with multiple versions installed?

Mike Groves

-----Original Message-----
From: Baranski, Detlef [mailto:Detlef.Baranski@PILKINGTON.de]
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 9:04 AM
To: VRF
Subject: [vrf] AW: RE: 7.0 Reminder!

Maybe the best way would be to name the .vee files for Version 7 to .vee7 if
you use many parallel installations. In general there is no more need to
limit the suffix to 3 letters...

Until now i rename my old vee-file to an "V7-" prefix to see the difference
if saved under V7.

detlef

-----Ursprngliche Nachricht-----
Von: BAYES,SCOTT (A-Loveland,ex1) [mailto:scott_bayes@agilent.com]
Gesendet: 23 March 2004 01:47
An: VRF
Cc: bill.ossmann@philips.com; PDL-LISTS,VRF (A-Lists,unix1)
Betreff: [vrf] RE: 7.0 Reminder!

Hi Mark, Bill, vrf,

Yes, you'll probably want to keep 6.x around until you are satisfied that
you (and your end-users) are completely moved over to 7.0.

I still have 5.01 through 7.0 installed on MY computer because many users
have not upgraded. Bummer.

:-)

So side-by-side installs are a good idea till you've cut ties with earlier
revisions. Just beware that only one revision can "own" the .vee suffix at
any one time (same is true for .vxe).

BTW, 7.0 fixes a bunch of elderly bugs (sorry, "defects"), too. After you
download and install 7.0 eval, open Help > Contents and Index, and select
"What's Been Fixed in This Version".

(Thanks for the humour, Mark)

Best Regards,

Scott Bayes
Software Technical Support

Agilent Technologies, Inc.
815 14th Street S.W.
Loveland, CO, U.S.A. 80537

970 679 3799 Tel
970 635 6867 Fax

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detlef.baranski Mar 25, 2004 2:04 AM
Mark Correct
Correct Answer
Maybe the best way would be to name the .vee files for Version 7 to .vee7 if
you use many parallel installations. In general there is no more need to
limit the suffix to 3 letters...

Until now i rename my old vee-file to an "V7-" prefix to see the difference
if saved under V7.

detlef

-----Ursprngliche Nachricht-----
Von: BAYES,SCOTT (A-Loveland,ex1) [mailto:scott_bayes@agilent.com]
Gesendet: 23 March 2004 01:47
An: VRF
Cc: bill.ossmann@philips.com; PDL-LISTS,VRF (A-Lists,unix1)
Betreff: [vrf] RE: 7.0 Reminder!

Hi Mark, Bill, vrf,

Yes, you'll probably want to keep 6.x around until you are satisfied that
you (and your end-users) are completely moved over to 7.0.

I still have 5.01 through 7.0 installed on MY computer because many users
have not upgraded. Bummer.

:-)

So side-by-side installs are a good idea till you've cut ties with earlier
revisions. Just beware that only one revision can "own" the .vee suffix at
any one time (same is true for .vxe).

BTW, 7.0 fixes a bunch of elderly bugs (sorry, "defects"), too. After you
download and install 7.0 eval, open Help > Contents and Index, and select
"What's Been Fixed in This Version".

(Thanks for the humour, Mark)

Best Regards,

Scott Bayes
Software Technical Support

Agilent Technologies, Inc.
815 14th Street S.W.
Loveland, CO, U.S.A. 80537

970 679 3799 Tel
970 635 6867 Fax

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Goldberg, Mark [mailto:Mark.Goldberg@ATK.COM]
> Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 3:25 PM
> To: BAYES,SCOTT (A-Loveland,ex1); PDL-LISTS,VRF (A-Lists,unix1)
> Cc: bill.ossmann@philips.com
> Subject: RE: [vrf] RE: 7.0 Reminder!
>
>
> So Scott, it sounds like we will all should keep 6.2 and 7.0
> installed on
> our systems not only to keep our backward compatibility but
> to help those in
> VRF that my not get upgrades right away. We still get posts
> from people
> using VEE5 and up, sorta regularly. Oh, and heaven forbid we
> find a bug we
> can't get around by upping older code! (Grin)
>
> Mark
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BAYES,SCOTT (A-Loveland,ex1) [mailto:scott_bayes@agilent.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 12:44 PM
> To: VRF
> Cc: bill.ossmann@philips.com
> Subject: [vrf] RE: 7.0 Reminder!
>
>
> Hi Bill and the vrf,
>
> Problem here is that if you forget and add one teeny-tiny 7.0 feature,
> SURPRISE!
>
> You can't save as 6.x.
>
> Darn! or even stronger language.
>
> Then someone would have to grovel manually through
> potentially thousands of
> objects looking for the guilty one. Very nasty if it's a line
> or lines of
> .NET formula code in a Formula box, maybe buried among dozens
> of lines of
> other 6.x-legal code (also VEE itself would have to snoop
> through everything
> looking for 7.0 stuff to decide which file can legally be
> formatted as 6.x,
> decidedly non-trivial in the case of formulas).
>
> <Enlightenment!!> And of course, if the formula text is fed
> in through a
> Control Pin, and therefore could come from any combination of text
> constants, math, data files, (even SCPI???) and text
> manipulation, it's
> essentially undecidable as to whether 6.x can handle it, even
> if 7.x can. I
> don't see a way around this one at all: I can see cases where
> the program
> runs fine in 7.0, but load it into 6.x and when you run it,
> it goes BOOM,
> not even a decent error message since 6.x doesn't know
> anything about this
> .NET stuff that could be wrong. Debugging that case could be
> a nightmare,
> and extremely expensive.
>
> I actually went through most of this discussion in the old
> RMB days, with
> RMB 7.0 (I was the R&D engineer who wrote the new 7.0 PROG2-format
> program-storing code). We came up with the same answer: 7.0
> did not attempt
> to save in 6.x format for a variety of excellent reasons.
>
> There's really not a good reliable answer to this problem,
> and unreliable
> answers are all too often unreliable at just the wrong moment.
>
> Best Regards,
>
>
> Scott Bayes
> Software Technical Support
>
> Agilent Technologies, Inc.
> 815 14th Street S.W.
> Loveland, CO, U.S.A. 80537
>
> 970 679 3799 Tel
> 970 635 6867 Fax
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: bill.ossmann@philips.com [mailto:bill.ossmann@philips.com]
> > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 9:39 AM
> > To: PDL-LISTS,VRF (A-Lists,unix1)
> > Subject: [vrf] RE: 7.0 Reminder!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Scott,
> >
> > In cases where the VEE 7.0 code contains features not found
> > in previous
> > versions, I think it would be perfectly acceptable to have it
> > refuse to
> > write in an earlier format, ideally providing a list of the
> > objects that
> > prevent it. What would be nice would be the ability to
> write files in
> > earlier formats for programs in which it is possible.
> >
> > Regards,
> > --
> > Bill Ossmann
> > Philips Ultrasound
> > e-mail: bill.ossmann@philips.com
> > --------------------------------------------------------------
> > -------------------
> >
> >
> > Hi Bruno and vrf-ers,
> >
> > Yes, this is something you'll have to consider.
> >
> > Problem is, it's very difficult, maybe impossible, to come up
> > with a design
> > that safely suppresses new features so you can export to
> > older VEE formats
> > without breaking the .vee application. For instance, if you
> > put some of the
> > new .NET stuff in your application, what do we do with it
> > when removing
> > this feature for export? Maybe comment out the Formula object
> > code lines?
> > Ouch, now your code doesn't work right, if at all! Maybe
> > remove the .NET
> > Formula Object altogether. Ouch again! (and more ouch for the
> > unconnected
> > input pins on other objects!). What else? I can't think of
> > much else we
> > could do in this situation.
> >
> > And once your .vee is exported back to 6.x, someone has to
> > figure out how
> > to make it work again, assuming that's even possible. You
> > have to hope the
> > damage isn't too extensive. And every time you modify or
> > enhance the app in
> > 7.0 and re-export to 6.x, you would have to fix it again.
> >
> > Yes, we might have been able to do something, but I don't
> know that it
> > would have been very useful, and it would have taken a very
> large R&D
> > effort for little real value. We preferred to put the effort
> > into Undo and
> > Panel Edit enhancements, the Properties window with
> > associated multi-object
> > property edit, etc.
> >
> > By the way, the new data types (UInt8, Int16, etc) introduced
> > in 6.0 had
> > very similar characteristics with respect to preventing
> > loading of 6.x .vee
> > files into 5.x. It's part of the price of progress.
> >
> > And Microsoft has the same barrier with their languages. VB6
> > code can come
> > into VB .NET with reasonable ease, though most applications
> > still require
> > anywhere from a little to a lot of manual intervention to
> complete the
> > conversion, since the conversion is not perfect. But don't
> > even think about
> > sending your VB .NET code back to VB6! I'm sure earlier revs
> > of VB and of
> > other Microsoft languages posed similar "challenges" for the
> > developer.
> >
> > Best Regards,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Scott Bayes
> > Software Technical Support
> >
> > Agilent Technologies, Inc.
> > 815 14th Street S.W.
> > Loveland, CO, U.S.A. 80537
> >
> > 970 679 3799 Tel
> > 970 635 6867 Fax
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Beliveau, Bruno [mailto:BrunoBeliveau@solectron.com]
> > Sent: Friday, March 19, 2004 3:29 PM
> > To: PDL-LISTS,VRF (A-Lists,unix1)
> > Cc: BAYES,SCOTT (A-Loveland,ex1)
> > Subject: Re: [vrf] 7.0 Reminder!
> >
> >
> >
> > This is a bug for people that send examples to help others
> > on the VRF.
> > Those with versions previous to 7 will not be able to
> > receive vee files
> > from those with version 7. With version 6, there was always the
> > possibility to edit the file with a text editor and modify
> > what version 5
> > doesn't understand (specially with reals ant integers).
> >
> >
> > The same problem when you have many tests stations installed
> > with versions
> > 5 or 6 and want to develop with the newer version 7 on your PC.
> >
> >
> > That would be a nice feature to be able to export to
> > previous version (and
> > loose some functionalities in the process)...
> >
> >
> > -----Message d'origine-----
> > De: BAYES,SCOTT (A-Loveland,ex1) [mailto:scott_bayes@agilent.com]
> > Date: 19 mars 2004 16:25
> >
> >
> > Hello vrf-ers,
> >
> >
> > *** Make copies of your existing .vee files before you edit
> > them in 7.0!
> > ***
> >
> >
> > Just a note to remind you that once you edit a .vee file
> > that originates
> > from an earlier version in 7.0, then save it, no earlier
> > version will be
> > able to open the saved file.
> >
> >
> > We had to change the .vee format to support the new .NET and other
> > features, which prevents older versions of VEE from being
> > able to read VEE
> > 7.0 files.
> >
> >
> > Also note that Execution Mode has nothing to do with this:
> > even if you set
> > the Execution Mode to an older one like VEE 5, VEE 7.0's
> > Save will write
> > the .vee in 7.0 language, not 5.0, and older revisions won't
> > be able to
> > load it.
> >
> >
> > So always make a copy first, in case you need to use the
> > .vee in the older
> > revision some day.
> >
> >
> > VEE 7.0 warns you about this when you try to save a .vee
> > that originated
> > in an earlier revision, but an extra reminder never hurts,
> > since you can
> > force VEE to save over the original if you ignore the warnings.
> >
> >
> > This kind of compatibility break has occurred a number of
> > times in past,
> > but it's been a while since it last occurred, and people
> > tend to forget.
> >
> >
> > ---
> > You are currently subscribed to vrf as: bill.ossmann@philips.com
> > To subscribe send a blank email to
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> > "owner-vrf@it.lists.it.agilent.com".
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ---
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VRFuser Mar 26, 2004 2:16 AM
Mark Correct
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"><HTML><HEAD><META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1"><META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1106" name=GENERATOR><STYLE></STYLE></HEAD><BODY bgColor=#ffffff><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi Detlef, hi Mike,</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><STRONG><FONT color=#ff0000>great idea</FONT></STRONG>. I checked it with my "antique" win98-system and VEE 3 (still very few "vees" left), 5, 6 and will continue this, as soon as VEE7 arrives. </FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>It also helps to keep track of what version I sold without opening the code.... marvellous!</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Peter</FONT></DIV><DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><A href="http://www.pcmess.com">www.pcmess.com</A><BR>Birkenweg 8<BR>D-87677 Stoettwang<BR>Tel: +498345482</FONT></DIV></DIV>---<BR>You are currently subscribed to vrf as: rsb@soco.agilent.com<BR>To subscribe send a blank email to "join-vrf@it.lists.it.agilent.com".<BR>To unsubscribe send a blank email to "leave-vrf@it.lists.it.agilent.com".<BR>To send messages to this mailing list, email "vrf@agilent.com". <BR>If you need help with the mailing list send a message to "owner-vrf@it.lists.it.agilent.com".</BODY></HTML>
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